108 vs 110 lobe separation
Whats a good LOBE Separation for nitrous | Yellow Bullet Forums AquaTraction Vs SeaDek: Which One Is Better For you? 110 LSA: On the other hand, 110 LSA is a wider LSA with almost no overlap. Well, If I am not mistaken, you must be looking for which angle has what impact on your engine or which would be the best. If the exhaust valve closes too early it will trap some of the spent gases in the combustion chamber, and if it closes too late it will over-scavenge the chamber and take out too much of the charge, again creating an artificially lean condition. Increased Effective Connectivity of the Left Parietal Lobe During Lobe separations on 383-406 cids.104-106-108-110? - Don Terrill's Speed by flat4racer17 Mon May 12, 2003 1:40 pm, Post That lopey idle that is universally loved, and part of the allure of a tight LSA cam, is actually misfire caused from a combination of exhaust dilution in the intake manifold and poor cylinder filling at idle. As a result, you can enjoy a pleasing engine outcome. Elle concerne 264 taxons des degrs divers. what to expect with different lobe centers | Chevy Nova Forum 2.1.3 Transponder reply modes (air-to-ground) 2.1.3.1 Transponders shall respond to Mode A interrogations in accordance with the provisions of 3.1.1.7.12.1 and to Mode C interrogations in accordance . That way you can discuss what you want from the engine and how changes in LSA or any of the other specs will affect how the engine performs. However, it is fixable. Here are the basics: higher lift values open the valves to increase airflow and longer duration keeps the valves open longer. The Idles increasing vacuum improves the idle quality and the engines overall performance. GRIND #: CRB3 3194 /3196 HR111. With minimal overlap and a steady manifold vacuum signal, they work great with fuel-injection systems and are the norm on modern pushrod engines, such as the LS and Gen III hemi. camshaft is a Cranecams F238. But to choose the perfect cam, all of that information needs understanding. It's the scavenging effect of the high velocity exhaust gases rushing out that pulls the fresh fuel/air charge into the chamber. The only reason I . I'm sorry to disagree with that incredibly well written article, but lobe separation by itself is absolutely freaking meaningless. Bad idea in my view. Thanks again. Enter lobe separation angle. Well, I saw that Erson makes some nice hydraulic rollers with 108 LSAs, and I know that tighter LSAs have more midrange, so I thought they might be worth a try. Either learn to fix it, or learn to write checks. somthing to that aspect. Coupled that with the low first gear of the five speed, it ought to create some real traction problems. Hopefully It will do fine in my 2276 mostly drag bug. When boost or nitrous are introduced, and engine builders contemplate choices between single-, dual- or reverse-pattern camshafts then the discussion gets muchmore technical. by Marc Mon May 12, 2003 11:38 am, Post I probably would have gone with 3.55 gears had I knows better.. Is There a Sequence? 110 LSA: But here, quite surprisingly, you have to face the reduction of the EGR effect due to the 110 LSA. The 120-degree cam minimized torque production through most of the curve, while the 112-degree cam offered more torque but slightly less peak power. Turbochargers are not as simple as they may sound; you may think of them only as power-boosting components. As the RPM's go up this is not as critical as the higher velocity of the air/fuel moving thru keeps it from getting contaminated. The engine has AFR heads, Crane rockers, a TCI balancer, a Scat Rotating assembly with Mahle pistons, an Edelbrock RPM Air-Gap intake, an MSD ignition, and an Aeromotive fuel system. by bug1914 Tue May 13, 2003 2:56 am, Post Big strokers like tighter LCA but it really depends on your combo and usage, theres great OTS cams but for a custom engine a custom cam is the way to go With identical cam lobes you won't see a bit of difference. Also If you go with 112 lobe centers, you create less valve overlap which will increase your compretion. Cam Advise - 332-428 Ford FE Engine Forum changing just the LSA on my cam wouldnt make a bit of difference on vacuum operated items E ericnova72 More for Less Racer Joined Jan 13, 2007 22,026 Posts 106 lobe sep. in a street car. | NastyZ28.com It produces peak torque earliercoming on quicker and strongerbut also it falls off quicker too. They also reduce stress on the outdrive. The 114o lobe will add a lot more vacuum at idle. pump gas, no additive's as well, runs good, i will put the highest octane in, which is 93.. by ANT Tue May 13, 2003 1:08 pm, Post Brul slid the 113-LSA cam, the widest of the test, into the engine's heart and set about putting all the pieces back in place. Really wide lobe separation angles are used in boosted applications. 106 LSA: There is a scale of standard cranking compression of the engine. Lobe Separation Angle "LSA "Jump to Latest Follow 1 - 17 of 17 Posts . So, which is better? Lobe separation angles, he continues, are influenced by the camshaft grind. It is dangerous to be right in matters on which the established authorities are wrong. All three terms are similar, as they all relate to the relationship between the centerline of the Intake lobe and the centerline of the Exhaust lobe. Post I don't know about 13 to one but I have seen 12 to one on a 350 chev in hot rod article, BUT the guy soft petals around on the street with no full throttle use and puts racing gas in at the track. A cam with a tighter LSA will require a looser torque converter, may not be able to run vacuum-assisted brakes, and doesn't play nice with fuel injection. This is ground into the cam and can't be changed without changing cams. The first cam featured a wide 120-degree LSA, while cam number two narrowed the angle to 112 degrees. 06 The ported heads featured a 2.165/1.590-inch valve combo. It's wet flow tested at 690cfm. But remember, although a broader powerband has a couple of acceleration advantages, it also comes with a few drawbacks. So, sit tight back and explore. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding. I've seen that Webcam cams can be ordered with either of the above. A wider lobe separation angle can often provide more power, but it can also lead to more wear on the engine. "Ninety-nine percent of cranking compression is dictated by static compression ratio and intake-valve closing point," said Comp Cams' Billy Godbold. cam for torque.110 or 112 LSA????? - Team Camaro Tech Is it a hydraulic roller as well? Anybody here run a 108 LSA? 106 or 110 lobe seperation | Team Chevelle The Fora platform includes forum software by XenForo. 110 LSA: On the other hand, 110 LSA is comparatively a wider LSA; it can generate a massive amount of RPM for the engine. by MELWAY Sat Dec 06, 2008 4:18 pm, Post Chevy Transmission Wont Shift Into 3rd: Finding the Main Culprit, Yamaha Lower Unit Drain Plug Size [Explained Everything], Does It Matter Which Ignition Coil Goes Where? Lunati's New Bootlegger Camshaft Series Has Strong Race - Dragzine its got a 3.73 posi and the Stock 4 speed with a very low 3.42 1st gear. Exhaust reversion is another undesirable side effect that can be caused by overlap. 106 Vs 110 Lobe Separation Angle: Real Impacts You Must Learn Idle quality was rough and the vacuum gauge showed only 9.8 in-Hg (inches of mercury). 108 Lobe Separation These are my motors specs 1979 - 347 Stroker 10:1 Compression Holley 670 Street Avenger or a Holley 650 (I have both) Roush 200 Cylinder Heads (minor head work) 1.6 Roller Rockers Shorty BBK Headers 373 Rear End 5 Speed Transmission Cross Gap Intake (Power Band 1500-6500) FlowMaster Dual Exhaust (of course no Cats) MSD 6Al A narrower lobe separation angle can provide less power but can also lead to less wear. Usually, this separation angle ranges from 95-degree to 120-degree. ditto with the above. (ICL + ECL) / 2 = LOBE SEPARATION ANGLE (LSA) LSA is a RESULT of the PROPER events. Walter Noah is a process engineer who has a knack for resolving even the toughest technical issue. Many later model engines use wide lobe separation angles to reduce overlap for idle quality and fuel economy. Also present during testing was a set of 1 7/8-inch Kooks headers, Comp hydraulic roller lifters, and F-body oil pan. A cam card with its myriad numbers, acronyms, and abbreviations is one red-pen stroke away from a failed math test. While a cam with a 108 lobe center will idle rougher. On a naturally aspirated engine, the lobe separation angle has an effect on whether the engine reaches peak torque a little earlier or later in the rpm range. A narrower LCA will increase valve overlap and close the (intake) valve earlier, which explains the typical rougher idler and more midrange behaviour. I do believe that stock VW seperation is 108 and 112 is used alot in turbo and midrange cams for VW's while 106 is used for the top end cams. A wider lobe center will give you more overall torque (comes in earlier and stays later). Comparison Table Between 106 Vs 110 Lobe Separation Angle. by xstfudonniex Sat Dec 06, 2008 4:21 pm, Post 110* LSA - lobe separation angle (lobe displacement angle) The +2* means your intake lobe centerline is advanced to obtain a 108* ICL - intake centerline and a 112* ECL - exhaust centerline. Camshaft: Hydraulic Roller, Comp Cam custom grind (ADV Duration 281-287,@ .050 230-236, lift 622I & 625E w/1.6 rockers.) A cam with a 112lobe center will idle smoother than a cam with a 110lobe center. So, the 110 LSA engine is a suitable choice for people prone to be the fan of a powerful engine with mighty acceleration power. I'd run it, just be sure to check valve to piston clearance, coil bind and retainer to guide boss/seal clearance. But, you may wonder knowing that a higher valve clearance rate reduces the chance of damaging the valve by the piston. But, the narrow or broad powerband choice varies from person to person. 3.75" stroke= 108 LSA 4.00" stroke= 110 LSA 4.25" stroke= 112 LSA 4.50" stroke= 114 LSA I can see exactly where his theory is coming from. Most cars use more than, Read More Does It Matter Which Ignition Coil Goes Where? We will safeguard your e-mail and only send content you request. But this is not the only reason. If you shift at 7500-7800 add 4-6 degrees to both intake and exhaust and spread the lobe separation to 108-110. We even treated them to some chamber work before installation. If you want a lumper idle go with a cam with 108 LSA, the tigher the LSA the idle will be rougher. The center of those 2 events is the LOBE CENTERLINE (ECL). Adding an aftermarket cam to an otherwise stock engine can boost output by 40-60 hp (or more) with no other changes (except possibly a valvespring upgrade). The Fora platform includes forum software by XenForo. On larger displacement units 116 to 118 degrees of separation are common. This wave tuning is what helps performance engines achieve volumetric efficiencies of more than 100 percent. I'd also go to a 110-112 lobe separation angle. Good cam for a lower rpm street engine. such as 290 @.050? A cam with 110 lobe center will pull approximately 14-18"of vacuum is borderline for that type of application. http://www.mustangworks.com/cgi-bin/moi-display.cgi?220, http://www.popularhotrodding.com/en6em_camshaft_specs/lobe_seperation_angle.html. by 3V Performance Sat Dec 06, 2008 4:38 pm, Post 13 The three power curves indicate that the wide (120-degree) LSA (green lines) lost considerable torque to the other two cams. So, now you, Read More Chevy Transmission Wont Shift Into 3rd: Finding the Main CulpritContinue, While changing the oil on your boats lower unit, you may need to change the drain plug, too. We do not stock profiles with 109 or 114 lobe centers. The engine will have weak performance in the low-end range.A low vacuum can also cause the brake pedal to be quite difficult to press. Cam ???? Same Cam 112 vs. 114 Sep., What happens? An RV or towing camshaft, which is considered a mild performance or an economy cam, will often have a narrower LSA, between 112 and 114 degrees. Alternatively, if you are running a bigger camshaft to gain maximum top-end power, cam makers often suggest reducing the lobe separation angle to recover power lost in the lower rev range.. Selecting a camshaft for a given engines purpose usually involves a compromise between low- or high-end power options, and the lobe separation angle (LSA) is one of those factors where engine builders have to make a choice between those priorities. that is why people running 112 or 114 lobe centres retard the cam ,that way the exhaust event is back were it was before .this helps in exhaust valve tempatures--anyway today i talked too barry who is the owner of shadbolt cams and we talked about cam lobe centres -he considers 108 centre quite narrow and for a very narrow power band operation ,with a 112 he figures with the carbs with straight & even runs at the valves there should be no noticable loss of low end power, a 112 lobe would be a great choice for a great street strip motor -better lower torque followed with a flatter rising torque curve as well as rpm range extended 500-700 rpm -. Yearh, I have been reading a lot about this issue. If a street car has smaller lift and duration numbers, they might run 112 or 114. On a tight lobe separation, like 106-108 degrees, the engine will build torque quickly and reach its peak early. 108 versus 110 will drive the power band down. " - Voltaire. The idle quality was better with the 112-degree LSA but not as good as the wider 120-degree cam.The ultra-wide 120-degree LSA lost low-speed power and never recovered, but know that this wide LSA is often beneficial on positive displacement, supercharged applications. LSA CAM TEST-108 vs 112 vs 120 - YouTube 106 LSA: At 106 LSA, the cylinder pressure is a bit higher. A cam in the 110112 LSA range provides the necessary idle lobe to appease gearhead ears with acceptable manifold vacuum to run vacuum-operated accessories. 110 will be a bit punchier in the midrange and probalby make a little more peak horsepower as long as a good exhaust is used. A forum community dedicated to hot rod owners and enthusiasts. The lobe separation angle in a natural car engine conveys a considerable impact, especially regarding the maximum torque. Another important measurement was the torque production at 4,000 rpm and this cam checked in with 484 lb-ft of torque. The other thing is that you can make more power with a smaller aftermarket cam. 106 LSA: At this LSA, the car machine has to confront the reduction of idle vacuum rate quite often. Frontal lobe epilepsy (FLE), the second most common focal epilepsy syndrome after temporal lobe epilepsy (TLE), is frequently drug-resistant and MRI-negative. A 112 LSA would be better if I had an automatic, but the engine builder (who has built many, many drag racing engines)told me I would have much faster acceleration with the 108, at the expense of a broader power band of course, but that 108 would not unduly penalize me for the street. Now that we have a basic understanding of lobe separation angle, we can put together a test to illustrate just what happens when you make changes to it. That is no accident. How To Properly Replace Ignition Coils, Chevy 350 Ignition Coil Location And Everything About Them, Heres What Causes Your Car to Bog Down When Accelerating. you cannot just take a random change in a lobe separation angle and say 1 is better than the other. Cam and Lifters, Hydraulic Roller Tappet, Advertised Duration 282/288, Lift .589/.600, Chevy, Big Block, Kit. I have seen a dyno test where an engine using identical duration and lift made more peak power with a 112 LSA than a 110 LSA. on average with a N/A motor if you stick the two cams in at the track the tighter lsa will be faster at the expense of idle quality. . = Moderately Wide 110-108 Deg. The lobe separation angle is the angle between the two camshaft lobes that act on the valves. Average power was also down, but the engine pulled ahead of the 101 cam at 5,400 rpm, picking up 6.5 hp at peak. These numbers can vary a few inches one way or the other, depending on several other aftermarket factors and your individual engine specifications, so you may want to check your vacuum once the cam is installed. dur. thanks. It really comes down to the application. I am trying to pick out a hydraulic roller cam for my 351W with AFR 185s. Contrariwise, 106 LSA car engines are the best choice for people seeking energy-efficient cars with moderate engine power. However, these rules are not absolute. When you purchase through links on our site, we may earn an affiliate commission, which supports our community. While lift and duration are most often discussed when talk turns to cam timing, there is a third variable that has a decided effect on both power and personality. If you look at the cam card, you will find a maximum lift column on the card.Now, all you have to do is, add up the two mentioned maximum angles and divide the summation by 2. 108 vs 112 LSA | Team Camaro Tech Ultimately, it makes the 110 LSA an oil-consuming LSA. As a result, a wider valve opening system with no overlapping allows more oil to fall through the oil inlet. hydraboost is the same as a vacuum brakebooster, only the booster is replaced by a unit that does the same but under hydraulic pressure. by trmnatr Sat Dec 06, 2008 10:45 pm, Post The 234o duration kind of eliminates the RV usage. Since we were only changing the lobe separation angle, we had to make sure every variable (air/fuel, timing, water, air, and oil temps) was identical during testing. Topping the short-block was a set of Chevrolet Performance CNC LS3 heads from Gandrud Chevrolet. Unfortunately, good street manners are often at odds with performance, as wilder cam timing usually decreases idle and (low-speed) driveability. The tighter the lobe center, the lower the RPM range; the wider the lobe center, the higher the RPM range. The tightest LSA (101) was worth 21.5 lb-ft of torque and a much broader powerbandat the cost of much lower idle vacuum, which would make it more temperamental in a street car. Looking at 108vs. 112 will have a smoother idle, a wider power band, and will work better with fuel injection. 112-110 Deg. Seeking 1/2" ID x 5/8" OD Black Exit Tubing for Radiator Overflow Reservoir. Nitrous engines, which make plenty of power and torque, often run wide lobe separation angles to moderate cylinder pressures and temperatures. by SStrokerAce Sat Dec 06, 2008 7:38 pm, Post indeed, expect low vacuum with anything lower than 110-ish. Now here is where it gets tricky. And better gas mileage. Pinning the tail on the perfect cam can certainly be a difficult task. Howards Cam Vs Comp Cam: Which Is The Best Option For You? How To Properly Replace Ignition CoilsContinue. The 110o will make more power overall. "When the low-pressure wave in the exhaust reflects into the intake, the pressure delta actually helps pull air and fuel into the cylinder. I have 108 for LSA and my headlights take awhile to go up when the car is idling. Due to the tightness and frequent overlapping of the intake and exhaust valves, the engine cant generate the high RPM as it is supposed to. [img]http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h291/downsideup09/DSCF2616-1.jpg[/img], [img]http://photos-g.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc1/hs139.snc1/5928_111214857139_110806152139_2127222_6826389_n.jpg[/img]. The Crane has a smoother idle, broader power band, and . Simply put, both 106 and 110 lobe separation angles have many advantages and disadvantages. Lobe Separation Angle, or LSA, is the number of degrees that separate the peak lift points of the cam's intake and exhaust lobes. Lobe separation angle does. Tests have shown that, for a given cam profile, a tighter (smaller) lobe center will produce more average horsepower and a quicker revving engine. Comp cam hydraulic roller lifters. I think that cam had 110 lobe sep. Im loking at a summit cam with close to the same lift and duration #s but 114 lobe sep. 238/248 duration, 300/310 adv. dont sound like a verry street friendly motor butany thoughts? As a result of this fall, the idle of the engine has to face suffering quite often. A mobile functional near-infrared spectroscopy (fNIRS) was used to record cerebral oxygenation signals in the left prefrontal cortex (LPFC), right prefrontal cortex (RPFC), left parietal lobe (LPL), and right parietal lobe (RPL) and analyze the EC of the cerebral cortex. According to the Motortrend, LSA (Lobe Separation Angle) is a wonderful approximation of the operation of the engine because it takes into account the relative time of the intake-valve events (intake opening, intake closing) and the exhaust-valve events (exhaust opening, exhaust closing) concerning each other.Above mentioned sequential activities allow LSA to be an accurate representation of the operation of the engine. Boom, you get the lobe separation angle of that engine. The lobe separation angle is the angle in camshaft degrees between the maximum lift points, or centerlines, of the intake and exhaust lobes. My engine shop builds all kinds of hot rod motors, and they told me that because I am running a 4 speed manual, I will better be able to take advantage of the 108 LSA. True enough, the tight LSA improved power through the entire rev range, from 3,600 to 6,500 rpm, but the extra power came with a penalty in idle quality. The piston and cylinder damage possibility is pretty low at 110 LSA. Let's just talk lobe sep angle. "It's not having what you want, it's wanting what you've got!" The Fora platform includes forum software by XenForo. Generally, naturally aspirated engines run narrower lobe separation angles of around 106 to 108 whereas supercharged, turbo or nitrous engines operate with 112 to 114 and higher. Where Is Cannibalism Legal,
Articles OTHER
Whats a good LOBE Separation for nitrous | Yellow Bullet Forums AquaTraction Vs SeaDek: Which One Is Better For you? 110 LSA: On the other hand, 110 LSA is a wider LSA with almost no overlap. Well, If I am not mistaken, you must be looking for which angle has what impact on your engine or which would be the best. If the exhaust valve closes too early it will trap some of the spent gases in the combustion chamber, and if it closes too late it will over-scavenge the chamber and take out too much of the charge, again creating an artificially lean condition. Increased Effective Connectivity of the Left Parietal Lobe During Lobe separations on 383-406 cids.104-106-108-110? - Don Terrill's Speed by flat4racer17 Mon May 12, 2003 1:40 pm, Post That lopey idle that is universally loved, and part of the allure of a tight LSA cam, is actually misfire caused from a combination of exhaust dilution in the intake manifold and poor cylinder filling at idle. As a result, you can enjoy a pleasing engine outcome. Elle concerne 264 taxons des degrs divers. what to expect with different lobe centers | Chevy Nova Forum 2.1.3 Transponder reply modes (air-to-ground) 2.1.3.1 Transponders shall respond to Mode A interrogations in accordance with the provisions of 3.1.1.7.12.1 and to Mode C interrogations in accordance . That way you can discuss what you want from the engine and how changes in LSA or any of the other specs will affect how the engine performs. However, it is fixable. Here are the basics: higher lift values open the valves to increase airflow and longer duration keeps the valves open longer. The Idles increasing vacuum improves the idle quality and the engines overall performance. GRIND #: CRB3 3194 /3196 HR111. With minimal overlap and a steady manifold vacuum signal, they work great with fuel-injection systems and are the norm on modern pushrod engines, such as the LS and Gen III hemi. camshaft is a Cranecams F238. But to choose the perfect cam, all of that information needs understanding. It's the scavenging effect of the high velocity exhaust gases rushing out that pulls the fresh fuel/air charge into the chamber. The only reason I . I'm sorry to disagree with that incredibly well written article, but lobe separation by itself is absolutely freaking meaningless. Bad idea in my view. Thanks again. Enter lobe separation angle. Well, I saw that Erson makes some nice hydraulic rollers with 108 LSAs, and I know that tighter LSAs have more midrange, so I thought they might be worth a try. Either learn to fix it, or learn to write checks. somthing to that aspect. Coupled that with the low first gear of the five speed, it ought to create some real traction problems. Hopefully It will do fine in my 2276 mostly drag bug. When boost or nitrous are introduced, and engine builders contemplate choices between single-, dual- or reverse-pattern camshafts then the discussion gets muchmore technical. by Marc Mon May 12, 2003 11:38 am, Post I probably would have gone with 3.55 gears had I knows better.. Is There a Sequence? 110 LSA: But here, quite surprisingly, you have to face the reduction of the EGR effect due to the 110 LSA. The 120-degree cam minimized torque production through most of the curve, while the 112-degree cam offered more torque but slightly less peak power. Turbochargers are not as simple as they may sound; you may think of them only as power-boosting components. As the RPM's go up this is not as critical as the higher velocity of the air/fuel moving thru keeps it from getting contaminated. The engine has AFR heads, Crane rockers, a TCI balancer, a Scat Rotating assembly with Mahle pistons, an Edelbrock RPM Air-Gap intake, an MSD ignition, and an Aeromotive fuel system. by bug1914 Tue May 13, 2003 2:56 am, Post Big strokers like tighter LCA but it really depends on your combo and usage, theres great OTS cams but for a custom engine a custom cam is the way to go With identical cam lobes you won't see a bit of difference. Also If you go with 112 lobe centers, you create less valve overlap which will increase your compretion. Cam Advise - 332-428 Ford FE Engine Forum changing just the LSA on my cam wouldnt make a bit of difference on vacuum operated items E ericnova72 More for Less Racer Joined Jan 13, 2007 22,026 Posts 106 lobe sep. in a street car. | NastyZ28.com It produces peak torque earliercoming on quicker and strongerbut also it falls off quicker too. They also reduce stress on the outdrive. The 114o lobe will add a lot more vacuum at idle. pump gas, no additive's as well, runs good, i will put the highest octane in, which is 93.. by ANT Tue May 13, 2003 1:08 pm, Post Brul slid the 113-LSA cam, the widest of the test, into the engine's heart and set about putting all the pieces back in place. Really wide lobe separation angles are used in boosted applications. 106 LSA: There is a scale of standard cranking compression of the engine. Lobe Separation Angle "LSA "Jump to Latest Follow 1 - 17 of 17 Posts . So, which is better? Lobe separation angles, he continues, are influenced by the camshaft grind. It is dangerous to be right in matters on which the established authorities are wrong. All three terms are similar, as they all relate to the relationship between the centerline of the Intake lobe and the centerline of the Exhaust lobe. Post I don't know about 13 to one but I have seen 12 to one on a 350 chev in hot rod article, BUT the guy soft petals around on the street with no full throttle use and puts racing gas in at the track. A cam with a tighter LSA will require a looser torque converter, may not be able to run vacuum-assisted brakes, and doesn't play nice with fuel injection. This is ground into the cam and can't be changed without changing cams. The first cam featured a wide 120-degree LSA, while cam number two narrowed the angle to 112 degrees. 06 The ported heads featured a 2.165/1.590-inch valve combo. It's wet flow tested at 690cfm. But remember, although a broader powerband has a couple of acceleration advantages, it also comes with a few drawbacks. So, sit tight back and explore. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding. I've seen that Webcam cams can be ordered with either of the above. A wider lobe separation angle can often provide more power, but it can also lead to more wear on the engine. "Ninety-nine percent of cranking compression is dictated by static compression ratio and intake-valve closing point," said Comp Cams' Billy Godbold. cam for torque.110 or 112 LSA????? - Team Camaro Tech Is it a hydraulic roller as well? Anybody here run a 108 LSA? 106 or 110 lobe seperation | Team Chevelle The Fora platform includes forum software by XenForo. 110 LSA: On the other hand, 110 LSA is comparatively a wider LSA; it can generate a massive amount of RPM for the engine. by MELWAY Sat Dec 06, 2008 4:18 pm, Post Chevy Transmission Wont Shift Into 3rd: Finding the Main Culprit, Yamaha Lower Unit Drain Plug Size [Explained Everything], Does It Matter Which Ignition Coil Goes Where? Lunati's New Bootlegger Camshaft Series Has Strong Race - Dragzine its got a 3.73 posi and the Stock 4 speed with a very low 3.42 1st gear. Exhaust reversion is another undesirable side effect that can be caused by overlap. 106 Vs 110 Lobe Separation Angle: Real Impacts You Must Learn Idle quality was rough and the vacuum gauge showed only 9.8 in-Hg (inches of mercury). 108 Lobe Separation These are my motors specs 1979 - 347 Stroker 10:1 Compression Holley 670 Street Avenger or a Holley 650 (I have both) Roush 200 Cylinder Heads (minor head work) 1.6 Roller Rockers Shorty BBK Headers 373 Rear End 5 Speed Transmission Cross Gap Intake (Power Band 1500-6500) FlowMaster Dual Exhaust (of course no Cats) MSD 6Al A narrower lobe separation angle can provide less power but can also lead to less wear. Usually, this separation angle ranges from 95-degree to 120-degree. ditto with the above. (ICL + ECL) / 2 = LOBE SEPARATION ANGLE (LSA) LSA is a RESULT of the PROPER events. Walter Noah is a process engineer who has a knack for resolving even the toughest technical issue. Many later model engines use wide lobe separation angles to reduce overlap for idle quality and fuel economy. Also present during testing was a set of 1 7/8-inch Kooks headers, Comp hydraulic roller lifters, and F-body oil pan. A cam card with its myriad numbers, acronyms, and abbreviations is one red-pen stroke away from a failed math test. While a cam with a 108 lobe center will idle rougher. On a naturally aspirated engine, the lobe separation angle has an effect on whether the engine reaches peak torque a little earlier or later in the rpm range. A narrower LCA will increase valve overlap and close the (intake) valve earlier, which explains the typical rougher idler and more midrange behaviour. I do believe that stock VW seperation is 108 and 112 is used alot in turbo and midrange cams for VW's while 106 is used for the top end cams. A wider lobe center will give you more overall torque (comes in earlier and stays later). Comparison Table Between 106 Vs 110 Lobe Separation Angle. by xstfudonniex Sat Dec 06, 2008 4:21 pm, Post 110* LSA - lobe separation angle (lobe displacement angle) The +2* means your intake lobe centerline is advanced to obtain a 108* ICL - intake centerline and a 112* ECL - exhaust centerline. Camshaft: Hydraulic Roller, Comp Cam custom grind (ADV Duration 281-287,@ .050 230-236, lift 622I & 625E w/1.6 rockers.) A cam with a 112lobe center will idle smoother than a cam with a 110lobe center. So, the 110 LSA engine is a suitable choice for people prone to be the fan of a powerful engine with mighty acceleration power. I'd run it, just be sure to check valve to piston clearance, coil bind and retainer to guide boss/seal clearance. But, you may wonder knowing that a higher valve clearance rate reduces the chance of damaging the valve by the piston. But, the narrow or broad powerband choice varies from person to person. 3.75" stroke= 108 LSA 4.00" stroke= 110 LSA 4.25" stroke= 112 LSA 4.50" stroke= 114 LSA I can see exactly where his theory is coming from. Most cars use more than, Read More Does It Matter Which Ignition Coil Goes Where? We will safeguard your e-mail and only send content you request. But this is not the only reason. If you shift at 7500-7800 add 4-6 degrees to both intake and exhaust and spread the lobe separation to 108-110. We even treated them to some chamber work before installation. If you want a lumper idle go with a cam with 108 LSA, the tigher the LSA the idle will be rougher. The center of those 2 events is the LOBE CENTERLINE (ECL). Adding an aftermarket cam to an otherwise stock engine can boost output by 40-60 hp (or more) with no other changes (except possibly a valvespring upgrade). The Fora platform includes forum software by XenForo. On larger displacement units 116 to 118 degrees of separation are common. This wave tuning is what helps performance engines achieve volumetric efficiencies of more than 100 percent. I'd also go to a 110-112 lobe separation angle. Good cam for a lower rpm street engine. such as 290 @.050? A cam with 110 lobe center will pull approximately 14-18"of vacuum is borderline for that type of application. http://www.mustangworks.com/cgi-bin/moi-display.cgi?220, http://www.popularhotrodding.com/en6em_camshaft_specs/lobe_seperation_angle.html. by 3V Performance Sat Dec 06, 2008 4:38 pm, Post 13 The three power curves indicate that the wide (120-degree) LSA (green lines) lost considerable torque to the other two cams. So, now you, Read More Chevy Transmission Wont Shift Into 3rd: Finding the Main CulpritContinue, While changing the oil on your boats lower unit, you may need to change the drain plug, too. We do not stock profiles with 109 or 114 lobe centers. The engine will have weak performance in the low-end range.A low vacuum can also cause the brake pedal to be quite difficult to press. Cam ???? Same Cam 112 vs. 114 Sep., What happens? An RV or towing camshaft, which is considered a mild performance or an economy cam, will often have a narrower LSA, between 112 and 114 degrees. Alternatively, if you are running a bigger camshaft to gain maximum top-end power, cam makers often suggest reducing the lobe separation angle to recover power lost in the lower rev range.. Selecting a camshaft for a given engines purpose usually involves a compromise between low- or high-end power options, and the lobe separation angle (LSA) is one of those factors where engine builders have to make a choice between those priorities. that is why people running 112 or 114 lobe centres retard the cam ,that way the exhaust event is back were it was before .this helps in exhaust valve tempatures--anyway today i talked too barry who is the owner of shadbolt cams and we talked about cam lobe centres -he considers 108 centre quite narrow and for a very narrow power band operation ,with a 112 he figures with the carbs with straight & even runs at the valves there should be no noticable loss of low end power, a 112 lobe would be a great choice for a great street strip motor -better lower torque followed with a flatter rising torque curve as well as rpm range extended 500-700 rpm -. Yearh, I have been reading a lot about this issue. If a street car has smaller lift and duration numbers, they might run 112 or 114. On a tight lobe separation, like 106-108 degrees, the engine will build torque quickly and reach its peak early. 108 versus 110 will drive the power band down. " - Voltaire. The idle quality was better with the 112-degree LSA but not as good as the wider 120-degree cam.The ultra-wide 120-degree LSA lost low-speed power and never recovered, but know that this wide LSA is often beneficial on positive displacement, supercharged applications. LSA CAM TEST-108 vs 112 vs 120 - YouTube 106 LSA: At 106 LSA, the cylinder pressure is a bit higher. A cam in the 110112 LSA range provides the necessary idle lobe to appease gearhead ears with acceptable manifold vacuum to run vacuum-operated accessories. 110 will be a bit punchier in the midrange and probalby make a little more peak horsepower as long as a good exhaust is used. A forum community dedicated to hot rod owners and enthusiasts. The lobe separation angle in a natural car engine conveys a considerable impact, especially regarding the maximum torque. Another important measurement was the torque production at 4,000 rpm and this cam checked in with 484 lb-ft of torque. The other thing is that you can make more power with a smaller aftermarket cam. 106 LSA: At this LSA, the car machine has to confront the reduction of idle vacuum rate quite often. Frontal lobe epilepsy (FLE), the second most common focal epilepsy syndrome after temporal lobe epilepsy (TLE), is frequently drug-resistant and MRI-negative. A 112 LSA would be better if I had an automatic, but the engine builder (who has built many, many drag racing engines)told me I would have much faster acceleration with the 108, at the expense of a broader power band of course, but that 108 would not unduly penalize me for the street. Now that we have a basic understanding of lobe separation angle, we can put together a test to illustrate just what happens when you make changes to it. That is no accident. How To Properly Replace Ignition Coils, Chevy 350 Ignition Coil Location And Everything About Them, Heres What Causes Your Car to Bog Down When Accelerating. you cannot just take a random change in a lobe separation angle and say 1 is better than the other. Cam and Lifters, Hydraulic Roller Tappet, Advertised Duration 282/288, Lift .589/.600, Chevy, Big Block, Kit. I have seen a dyno test where an engine using identical duration and lift made more peak power with a 112 LSA than a 110 LSA. on average with a N/A motor if you stick the two cams in at the track the tighter lsa will be faster at the expense of idle quality. . = Moderately Wide 110-108 Deg. The lobe separation angle is the angle between the two camshaft lobes that act on the valves. Average power was also down, but the engine pulled ahead of the 101 cam at 5,400 rpm, picking up 6.5 hp at peak. These numbers can vary a few inches one way or the other, depending on several other aftermarket factors and your individual engine specifications, so you may want to check your vacuum once the cam is installed. dur. thanks. It really comes down to the application. I am trying to pick out a hydraulic roller cam for my 351W with AFR 185s. Contrariwise, 106 LSA car engines are the best choice for people seeking energy-efficient cars with moderate engine power. However, these rules are not absolute. When you purchase through links on our site, we may earn an affiliate commission, which supports our community. While lift and duration are most often discussed when talk turns to cam timing, there is a third variable that has a decided effect on both power and personality. If you look at the cam card, you will find a maximum lift column on the card.Now, all you have to do is, add up the two mentioned maximum angles and divide the summation by 2. 108 vs 112 LSA | Team Camaro Tech Ultimately, it makes the 110 LSA an oil-consuming LSA. As a result, a wider valve opening system with no overlapping allows more oil to fall through the oil inlet. hydraboost is the same as a vacuum brakebooster, only the booster is replaced by a unit that does the same but under hydraulic pressure. by trmnatr Sat Dec 06, 2008 10:45 pm, Post The 234o duration kind of eliminates the RV usage. Since we were only changing the lobe separation angle, we had to make sure every variable (air/fuel, timing, water, air, and oil temps) was identical during testing. Topping the short-block was a set of Chevrolet Performance CNC LS3 heads from Gandrud Chevrolet. Unfortunately, good street manners are often at odds with performance, as wilder cam timing usually decreases idle and (low-speed) driveability. The tighter the lobe center, the lower the RPM range; the wider the lobe center, the higher the RPM range. The tightest LSA (101) was worth 21.5 lb-ft of torque and a much broader powerbandat the cost of much lower idle vacuum, which would make it more temperamental in a street car. Looking at 108vs. 112 will have a smoother idle, a wider power band, and will work better with fuel injection. 112-110 Deg. Seeking 1/2" ID x 5/8" OD Black Exit Tubing for Radiator Overflow Reservoir. Nitrous engines, which make plenty of power and torque, often run wide lobe separation angles to moderate cylinder pressures and temperatures. by SStrokerAce Sat Dec 06, 2008 7:38 pm, Post indeed, expect low vacuum with anything lower than 110-ish. Now here is where it gets tricky. And better gas mileage. Pinning the tail on the perfect cam can certainly be a difficult task. Howards Cam Vs Comp Cam: Which Is The Best Option For You? How To Properly Replace Ignition CoilsContinue. The 110o will make more power overall. "When the low-pressure wave in the exhaust reflects into the intake, the pressure delta actually helps pull air and fuel into the cylinder. I have 108 for LSA and my headlights take awhile to go up when the car is idling. Due to the tightness and frequent overlapping of the intake and exhaust valves, the engine cant generate the high RPM as it is supposed to. [img]http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h291/downsideup09/DSCF2616-1.jpg[/img], [img]http://photos-g.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc1/hs139.snc1/5928_111214857139_110806152139_2127222_6826389_n.jpg[/img]. The Crane has a smoother idle, broader power band, and . Simply put, both 106 and 110 lobe separation angles have many advantages and disadvantages. Lobe Separation Angle, or LSA, is the number of degrees that separate the peak lift points of the cam's intake and exhaust lobes. Lobe separation angle does. Tests have shown that, for a given cam profile, a tighter (smaller) lobe center will produce more average horsepower and a quicker revving engine. Comp cam hydraulic roller lifters. I think that cam had 110 lobe sep. Im loking at a summit cam with close to the same lift and duration #s but 114 lobe sep. 238/248 duration, 300/310 adv. dont sound like a verry street friendly motor butany thoughts? As a result of this fall, the idle of the engine has to face suffering quite often. A mobile functional near-infrared spectroscopy (fNIRS) was used to record cerebral oxygenation signals in the left prefrontal cortex (LPFC), right prefrontal cortex (RPFC), left parietal lobe (LPL), and right parietal lobe (RPL) and analyze the EC of the cerebral cortex. According to the Motortrend, LSA (Lobe Separation Angle) is a wonderful approximation of the operation of the engine because it takes into account the relative time of the intake-valve events (intake opening, intake closing) and the exhaust-valve events (exhaust opening, exhaust closing) concerning each other.Above mentioned sequential activities allow LSA to be an accurate representation of the operation of the engine. Boom, you get the lobe separation angle of that engine. The lobe separation angle is the angle in camshaft degrees between the maximum lift points, or centerlines, of the intake and exhaust lobes. My engine shop builds all kinds of hot rod motors, and they told me that because I am running a 4 speed manual, I will better be able to take advantage of the 108 LSA. True enough, the tight LSA improved power through the entire rev range, from 3,600 to 6,500 rpm, but the extra power came with a penalty in idle quality. The piston and cylinder damage possibility is pretty low at 110 LSA. Let's just talk lobe sep angle. "It's not having what you want, it's wanting what you've got!" The Fora platform includes forum software by XenForo. Generally, naturally aspirated engines run narrower lobe separation angles of around 106 to 108 whereas supercharged, turbo or nitrous engines operate with 112 to 114 and higher.